Willis Carto archive

Including information about his associates

Judgment Debtor’s Examination of Willis Carto - February 27, 1998


 1          SUPERIOR COURT OF THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA

 2      FOR THE COUNTY OF SAN DIEGO, NORTH COUNTY BRANCH

 3                 JUDGMENT DEBTOR EXAMINATION

 4
                                            )
 5  LEGION FOR THE SURVIVAL OF              )
    FREEDOM, INC., A TEXAS CORPORATION,     )
 6                                          )
                       PLAINTIFF,           )
 7                                          )     
                                            )
 8         VS.                              ) NO. N64584
                                            )
 9  WILLIS CARTO, ET AL.,                   )
                                            )
10                     DEFENDANTS.          )
    ________________________________________)
11

12                 DEPOSITION OF WILLIS CARTO

13                 TAKEN AT VISTA, CALIFORNIA
                        FEBRUARY 27, 1998
14

15

16  KOLLEEN FREYMUELLER, REGISTERED PROFESSIONAL REPORTER 
    CERTIFICATE NO. 11230
17

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                                                               1
			
			

			

 1                 DEPOSITION OF WILLIS CARTO 

 2

 3         PURSUANT TO NOTICE TO TAKE DEPOSITION ON THE 27TH

 4  DAY OF FEBRUARY 1998, COMMENCING AT THE HOUR OF 10:35 

 5  O'CLOCK A.M., AT 325 S. MELROSE, DEPARTMENT D, IN THE 

 6  CITY OF VISTA, COUNTY OF SAN DIEGO, STATE OF CALIFORNIA, 

 7  BEFORE ME, KOLLEEN FREYMUELLER, CERTIFIED SHORTHAND 

 8  REPORTER IN AND FOR THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA, PERSONALLY 

 9  APPEARED:

10                        WILLIS CARTO, 

11  CALLED AS A WITNESS BY THE PLAINTIFF, WHO BEING BY ME 

12  FIRST DULY SWORN, WAS THEREUPON EXAMINED IN SAID CAUSE.

13

14                    APPEARANCES

15      FOR THE PLAINTIFF: 
                  BY:  ELIZABETH ARONSON, ESQ.
16                AND
                  BRYAN D. SAMPSON, ESQ. 
17                2139 FIRST AVENUE
                  SAN DIEGO, CALIFORNIA  92101 
18                (619) 557-9420

19      FOR THE DEFENDANTS:
                  J. BRIAN URTNOWSKI & ASSOCIATES
20                BY:  J. BRIAN URTNOWSKI, ESQ.
                  4695 MACARTHUR COURT, SUITE 590
21                NEWPORT BEACH, CALIFORNIA  92660
                  (714) 752-5370 
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                                                               3
			
			


 1                          EXAMINATION

 2  BY MS. ARONSON:  

 3          Q     WOULD YOU PLEASE SPELL YOUR FULL NAME FOR 

 4  THE RECORD.

 5          A     WILLIS A. CARTO, W-I-L-L-I-S, A., CARTO, 

 6  C-A-R-T-O.

 7          Q     WHAT DOES THE “A” STAND FOR?

 8          A     ALLISON, A-, DOUBLE L, -I-S-O-N.

 9          Q     HAVE YOU EVER USED ANY OTHER NAMES BESIDES 

10  THE ONE YOU HAVE JUST GIVEN US?  

11                (DISCUSSION OFF THE RECORD.)

12                THE WITNESS:  I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO 

13  PROVIDE THAT ANSWER ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT 

14  AGAINST SELF-INCRIMINATION.

15  BY MS. ARONSON:        

16          Q     HAVE YOU EVER USED THE NAME WILLIS CARZO, 

17  C-A-R-Z-O?  

18                (DISCUSSION OFF THE RECORD.) 

19                THE WITNESS:  NOT THAT I REMEMBER.

20  BY MS. ARONSON:        

21          Q     HAVE YOU EVER USED THE NAME WILL GARTO, 

22  G-A-R-T-O?

23          A     NOT THAT I RECALL.

24          Q     HAVE YOU EVER USED THE NAME BILL CARTER, 

25  C-A-R-T-E-R?  

26                (DISCUSSION OFF THE RECORD.)

27                MR. URTNOWSKI:  COULD YOU REPEAT THE 

28  QUESTION?


                                                               4
			
			


 1  BY MS. ARONSON:  

 2          Q     HAVE YOU EVER USED THE NAME BILL CARTER, 

 3  C-A-R-T-E-R?

 4          A     YES.

 5          Q     HAVE YOU EVER USED THE NAME J.W. YOUNG?

 6                MR. URTNOWSKI:  WE ARE GOING TO TAKE A 

 7  BREAK.  

 8                    (BRIEF BREAK TAKEN.)

 9                MS. ARONSON:  BACK ON THE RECORD.

10                MR. URTNOWSKI:  COULD YOU READ IT BACK, 

11  PLEASE.

12           (THE RECORD WAS READ BY THE REPORTER.)

13  BY MS. ARONSON:  

14          Q     NOW THAT YOU HAVE HAD A CHANCE TO CONFER — 

15  NOW THAT YOU HAVE CONFERRED WITH YOUR COUNSEL, I JUST 

16  WANT TO UNDERSTAND WHETHER YOU HAD EVER USED THE NAME 

17  J.W. YOUNG?

18          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO ANSWER ASSERTING 

19  MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST SELF-INCRIMINATION.

20          Q     HAVE YOU EVER USED NAME SAMUEL P. FONER, 

21  F-O-N-E-R?

22          A     NO.

23          Q     HAVE YOU EVER GONE BY THE NAME FRANK 

24  TOMPKINS, T-O-M-P-K-I-N-S?

25          A     NO.

26          Q     HAVE YOU EVER USED THE NAME E.L. ANDERSON?

27          A     YES.

28          Q     HAVE YOU REPRESENTED THAT YOU WERE A PH.D.?


                                                               5
			
			


 1          A     NO.

 2          Q     DO YOU, IN FACT, HOLD A PH.D., SIR?

 3          A     NO.

 4          Q     HAVE YOU EVER USED THE NAME A. CLIENT, 

 5  C-L-I-E-N-T?

 6          A     NO.

 7                (DISCUSSION OFF THE RECORD.)

 8                THE WITNESS:  I BETTER SAY I DON'T KNOW.  I 

 9  DON'T REMEMBER ANY SUCH — 

10  BY MS. ARONSON:  

11          Q     IS THAT YOUR ANSWER OR YOUR COUNSEL'S, SIR?

12                MR. URTNOWSKI:  THAT IS HIS ANSWER.  IF 

13  IT’s MY ANSWER, I WILL PUT IT ON THE RECORD.

14                MS. ARONSON:  I WAS JUST ASKING WHETHER 

15  THAT IS HIS ANSWER.

16                MR. URTNOWSKI:  THAT IS HIS ANSWER.  IT’s 

17  NOT MY ANSWER.  I'M NOT UNDER TESTIMONY HERE.  WHEN I 

18  GIVE AN ANSWER, I WILL PUT IT ON THE RECORD, COUNSEL.

19                MS. ARONSON:  I JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE 

20  THAT WAS CLEAR.  THANK YOU, SIR.  

21          Q     CAN I PLEASE HAVE YOUR DATE OF BIRTH?

22          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO PROVIDE THIS 

23  INFORMATION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

24  SELF-INCRIMINATION.

25          Q     IS JULY 17TH, 1926, YOUR BIRTHDAY?          

26                (DISCUSSION OFF THE RECORD.) 

27                THE WITNESS:  I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO 

28  PROVIDE THIS INFORMATION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT 


                                                               6
			
			


 1  RIGHT AGAINST SELF-INCRIMINATION.

 2  BY MS. ARONSON:  

 3          Q     WHAT IS YOUR SOCIAL SECURITY NUMBER, SIR?

 4          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO ANSWER THAT 

 5  QUESTION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

 6  SELF-INCRIMINATION.

 7          Q     WHAT IS YOUR PRESENT RESIDENCE?

 8          A     I — 

 9                (DISCUSSION OFF THE RECORD.)

10                THE WITNESS:  WASHINGTON D.C.

11  BY MS. ARONSON:  

12          Q     AND THE FULL ADDRESS, SIR?

13          A     130 THIRD STREET, SOUTHEAST.

14          Q     ZIP CODE?

15          A     20003.

16          Q     IS THIS A HOUSE OR AN APARTMENT?

17          A     APARTMENT.

18          Q     AND DO YOU OWN THIS APARTMENT, OR DO YOU 

19  RENT?

20          A     RENT.

21          Q     WHAT IS THE NAME OF YOUR LANDLADY, SIR, OR 

22  LANDOWNER?  

23                (DISCUSSION OFF THE RECORD.)

24                MR. URTNOWSKI:  WE'RE GOING OFF THE 

25  RECORD.  

26                    (BRIEF BREAK TAKEN.) 

27                MR. URTNOWSKI:  COULD YOU READ THE QUESTION 

28  BACK, PLEASE?


                                                               7
			
			


 1           (THE RECORD WAS READ BY THE REPORTER.)        

 2                THE WITNESS:  WILLIAM REYNOLDS.  

 3  BY MS. ARONSON:  

 4          Q     DO YOU HAVE MR. REYNOLDS' ADDRESS, SIR?

 5          A     NO.

 6          Q     DO YOU HAVE A TELEPHONE NUMBER AT WHICH 

 7  MR. REYNOLDS CAN BE REACHED?

 8          A     NO.

 9                MS. ARONSON:  WOULD YOU PLEASE READ BACK 

10  THE ADDRESS THAT WAS GIVEN?  

11           (THE RECORD WAS READ BY THE REPORTER.)

12  BY MS. ARONSON:  

13          Q     SIR, YOU HAVE STATED THAT 130 THIRD STREET 

14  WAS YOUR RESIDENCE.  

15                IS THAT AN APARTMENT OR AN OFFICE?

16          A     APARTMENT.

17          Q     DO YOU HAVE ANY OFFICES LOCATED AT THAT 

18  SAME ADDRESS?  

19                (DISCUSSION OFF THE RECORD.)

20                MR. URTNOWSKI:  COULD YOU REPHRASE THE 

21  QUESTION, PLEASE.

22                MS. ARONSON:  SURE.  I'D BE HAPPY TO.  

23          Q     IS THAT APARTMENT ALSO SERVED AS AN OFFICE 

24  FOR ANY REASON?

25          A     YES.  

26          Q     WHAT WOULD THAT BE THE OFFICE OF, SIR?

27          A     WELL, I HAVE AN OFFICE THERE.

28          Q     OFFICE FOR ANY PARTICULAR COMPANY OR 


                                                               8
			
			


 1  CORPORATION?

 2          A     YES.

 3          Q     AND WHAT COMPANY, SIR?

 4          A     LIBERTY LOBBY.

 5          Q     DO YOU HAVE ANY OTHER RESIDENCES WITHIN THE 

 6  WASHINGTON D.C. AREA?

 7          A     NO.

 8          Q     DO YOU HAVE ANY OTHER RESIDENCES AT ALL?

 9          A     NO.

10          Q     DO YOU HAVE A RESIDENCE HERE IN ESCONDIDO, 

11  CALIFORNIA?

12          A     I HAVE AN OFFICE.  

13          Q     WHERE IS THAT OFFICE LOCATED, SIR?

14          A     1718 Quail Ridge ROAD.

15          Q     WOULD THAT BE AN OFFICE BUILDING?

16          A     NO.

17          Q     WHAT TYPE OF STRUCTURE IS THAT, SIR?

18          A     IT’s A HOUSE.

19          Q     HOW MANY ROOMS ARE IN THAT HOUSE?  

20                (DISCUSSION OFF THE RECORD.)

21                THE WITNESS:  WELL, MY OFFICE IS ONE ROOM.

22  BY MS. ARONSON:        

23          Q     THAT WASN'T THE QUESTION, SIR.  

24                THE QUESTION IS:  HOW MANY ROOMS ARE 

25  LOCATED IN THAT HOUSE?

26                MR. URTNOWSKI:  OBJECTION.  RELEVANCE.  

27  INSTRUCTING THE WITNESS NOT TO ANSWER.  IT HAS NO BEARING 

28  ON ATTEMPT TO COLLECT A JUDGMENT, HOW MANY ROOMS ARE IN 


                                                               9
			
			


 1  THIS HOUSE.

 2                MS. ARONSON:  OBJECTION IS NOTED.  ARE YOU 

 3  INSTRUCTING THE — 

 4                MR. URTNOWSKI:  THAT IS WHAT I SAID.  I 

 5  INSTRUCT THE WITNESS NOT TO RESPOND.

 6  BY MS. ARONSON:  

 7          Q     DOES ANYBODY RESIDE AT THIS HOUSE?

 8          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO PROVIDE AN ANSWER 

 9  TO THAT QUESTION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT 

10  AGAINST SELF-INCRIMINATION.

11          Q     DOES ANY OTHER PERSON HAVE AN OFFICE WITHIN 

12  THIS OFFICE?

13          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO PROVIDE THIS 

14  INFORMATION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

15  SELF-INCRIMINATION.

16          Q     HAVE YOU, YOURSELF, EVER HELD RESIDENCE 

17  WITHIN THIS HOUSE?  

18                (DISCUSSION OFF THE RECORD.)

19                THE WITNESS:  I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO 

20  PROVIDE THIS INFORMATION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT 

21  RIGHT AGAINST SELF-INCRIMINATION.

22  BY MS. ARONSON:      

23          Q     WHO OWNS THE PROPERTY AT 1718 Quail Ridge 

24  ROAD?

25          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO PROVIDE THIS 

26  INFORMATION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

27  SELF-INCRIMINATION.

28          Q     MR. CARTO, I HAVE INFORMATION THAT YOU HAD 


                                                               10
			
			


 1  BEEN SUBPENAED TO BRING DOCUMENTS WITH YOU HERE TODAY.    

 2               HAVE YOU BROUGHT ANY OF THOSE DOCUMENTS?

 3          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO PROVIDE ANY 

 4  DOCUMENTS ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

 5  SELF-INCRIMINATION.

 6          Q     THAT WAS MY NEXT QUESTION.  

 7                BUT THE ANSWER TO THAT QUESTION IS “NO,” 

 8  CORRECT?

 9          A     CORRECT.

10          Q     MR. CARTO, DO YOU HAVE ANY INTENTION OF 

11  ANSWERING ANY QUESTIONS WITH REGARDS TO YOUR ASSETS AT 

12  THIS TIME? 

13                MR. URTNOWSKI:  DEPENDS HOW THE QUESTIONS 

14  ARE PHRASED.

15                MS. ARONSON:  I'M SORRY.  IS THAT 

16  MR. Carto’s ANSWER?

17                MR. URTNOWSKI:  THAT IS MY ANSWER AS HIS 

18  COUNSEL.

19                THE WITNESS:  THAT IS MY ANSWER.

20  BY MS. ARONSON:  

21          Q     DO YOU HAVE ANY INTENTION TO ANSWER ANY 

22  QUESTIONS REGARDING THE LOCATION OF ASSETS AT THIS TIME?

23                MR. URTNOWSKI:  IT’s OVERBROAD.  INSTRUCT 

24  THE WITNESS NOT TO ANSWER.  IT’s AMBIGUOUS.

25                MS. ARONSON:  TAKE A TWO-SECOND BREAK.      

26                (BRIEF BREAK TAKEN.) 

27  BY MS. ARONSON:  

28          Q     MR. CARTO, ARE YOU CARRYING A WALLET WITH 


                                                               11
			
			


 1  YOU TODAY, SIR?

 2          A     YES.

 3          Q     WOULD YOU MIND PLEASE TAKING OUT THAT 

 4  WALLET.

 5                MR. URTNOWSKI:  YES, HE WOULD.

 6                MS. ARONSON:  IS THAT A PROPER OBJECTION?

 7                THE WITNESS:  I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO 

 8  COMPLY ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

 9  SELF-INCRIMINATION.

10  BY MS. ARONSON:

11          Q     SIR, DO YOU OWN ANY BANK ACCOUNTS?

12          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO ANSWER THAT 

13  QUESTION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

14  SELF-INCRIMINATION.

15          Q     MR. CARTO, DO YOU OWN ANY AUTOMOBILES?

16          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO ANSWER ASSERTING 

17  MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST SELF-INCRIMINATION.

18          Q     DO YOU DRIVE A CAR?

19          A     YES.

20          Q     WHAT IS THE YEAR, MAKE AND MODEL NUMBER OF 

21  THAT CAR?

22          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO ANSWER THAT 

23  QUESTION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

24  SELF-INCRIMINATION.

25          Q     MR. CARTO, DO YOU OWN ANY REAL PROPERTY?

26          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO ANSWER THAT 

27  QUESTION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

28  SELF-INCRIMINATION.


                                                               12
			
			


 1          Q     DO YOU OWN ANY JEWELRY?

 2          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO PROVIDE THAT 

 3  INFORMATION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

 4  SELF-INCRIMINATION.

 5          Q     MR. CARTO, DO YOU OWN ANY PROPERTY VALUED 

 6  AT OVER $500?  

 7          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO ANSWER THAT 

 8  QUESTION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

 9  SELF-INCRIMINATION.

10          Q     MR. CARTO, DO YOU HAVE ANY INSURANCE TO 

11  COVER PERSONAL PROPERTY?

12          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO ANSWER THAT 

13  QUESTION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

14  SELF-INCRIMINATION.

15          Q     MR. CARTO, DO YOU BELONG TO ANY COUNTRY 

16  CLUBS?

17          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO ANSWER THAT 

18  QUESTION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

19  SELF-INCRIMINATION.

20          Q     DO YOU BELONG TO ANY PROFESSIONAL OR 

21  NONPROFESSIONAL ORGANIZATIONS?

22          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO ANSWER THAT 

23  QUESTION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

24  SELF-INCRIMINATION.

25          Q     DO YOU HAVE A SAFE-DEPOSIT BOX?

26          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO ANSWER THAT 

27  QUESTION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

28  SELF-INCRIMINATION. 


                                                               13
			
			


 1          Q     DO YOU HAVE ANY FINANCIAL ACCOUNTS IN ANY 

 2  FOREIGN COUNTRIES?

 3          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO ANSWER THAT 

 4  QUESTION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

 5  SELF-INCRIMINATION.

 6          Q     MR. CARTO, DO YOU OWN ANY BONDS?

 7          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO ANSWER THAT 

 8  QUESTION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

 9  SELF-INCRIMINATION.

10          Q     DO YOU OWN ANY PATENT RIGHTS?

11          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO ANSWER THAT 

12  QUESTION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

13  SELF-INCRIMINATION. 

14          Q     MR. CARTO, DO YOU USE AN ACCOUNTANT?

15          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO ANSWER THAT 

16  QUESTION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

17  SELF-INCRIMINATION.

18          Q     DO YOU CURRENTLY WORK?  

19                (DISCUSSION OFF THE RECORD.)

20                THE WITNESS:  I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO 

21  ANSWER THAT QUESTION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT 

22  AGAINST SELF-INCRIMINATION.

23  BY MS. ARONSON:        

24          Q     MR. CARTO, HAVE YOU MADE ANY LOANS TO 

25  ANYONE?

26          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO ANSWER THAT 

27  QUESTION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

28  SELF-INCRIMINATION.


                                                               14
			
			


 1          Q     DO YOU HAVE ANY JUDGMENTS IN WHICH YOU ARE 

 2  A JUDGMENT CREDITOR?

 3          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO ANSWER THAT 

 4  QUESTION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

 5  SELF-INCRIMINATION.

 6          Q     OKAY.  IT MIGHT HELP IF YOU SAY, “I TAKE 

 7  THE FIFTH.”  WE CAN SHORTEN THESE PROCEEDINGS A LITTLE 

 8  BIT.  HOW’s THAT?

 9          A     FINE.

10                MR. URTNOWSKI:  MR. CARTO, RESPOND ANY WAY 

11  YOU FEEL COMFORTABLE.

12  BY MS. ARONSON:  

13          Q     AND YOU'RE WELCOME TO DO THAT, ALSO.  

14                MR. CARTO, DO YOU HAVE A KEY CHAIN WITH YOU 

15  TODAY?  

16          A     SORRY?

17          Q     DO YOU HAVE A KEY CHAIN WITH YOU?

18          A     NO.

19          Q     DO YOU HAVE ANY KEYS IN YOUR POSSESSION AT 

20  THE MOMENT?

21          A     NO.

22          Q     DO YOU KNOW IF THERE ARE ANY TAX LIENS 

23  FILED AGAINST YOU?

24          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO ANSWER THAT 

25  QUESTION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

26  SELF-INCRIMINATION.

27          Q     WHILE ON THE RECORD, I'D LIKE TO SERVE YOU 

28  WITH A COUPLE OF ITEMS.  FIRST, THIS IS A COPY OF THE 


                                                               15
			
			


 1  ORDER TO SHOW CAUSE REGARDING CONTEMPT, WHICH WE HAD DONE 

 2  TODAY.

 3                MR. URTNOWSKI:  THANK YOU.

 4                MS. ARONSON:  THANK YOU.

 5                MR. URTNOWSKI:  I CAN SERVE THIS FOR YOU.

 6                MS. ARONSON:  THANK YOU.  JUST A MOMENT 

 7  PLEASE.  

 8                (DISCUSSION OFF THE RECORD.) 

 9  BY MS. ARONSON:  

10          Q     SIR, ARE YOU MARRIED?

11          A     YES.

12          Q     WHAT IS YOUR WIFE’s NAME?

13          A     ELISABETH.

14          Q     ELISABETH.  

15                AND DOES SHE SHARE YOUR LAST NAME?

16          A     YES.

17          Q     DOES SHE HAVE ANY OTHER NAMES, A MIDDLE 

18  NAME?

19          A     WELL, I DON'T KNOW.  SHE IS MARRIED, AND SO 

20  I GUESS HER NAME IS MRS. WILLIS CARTO.

21          Q     AND DO YOU KNOW IF YOUR WIFE HAS A MIDDLE 

22  NAME?

23          A     WELL, BEFORE SHE WAS — YES. 

24          Q     WHAT IS THAT NAME?

25          A     HER MIDDLE NAME IS ELISABETH.

26          Q     AND HER FIRST NAME IS ALSO ELISABETH?

27          A     NO.

28          Q     WHAT IS HER FIRST NAME, SIR?


                                                               16
			
			


 1          A     WALTRAUB, W-A-L-T-R-A-U-B.

 2          Q     WHAT IS HER MAIDEN NAME, SIR?

 3          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO ANSWER THAT 

 4  QUESTION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

 5  SELF-INCRIMINATION.

 6          Q     HAVE YOU EVER BEEN MARRIED PRIOR TO THIS 

 7  TIME?

 8                (DISCUSSION OFF THE RECORD.)

 9                THE WITNESS:  I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO 

10  ANSWER THAT QUESTION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT 

11  AGAINST SELF-INCRIMINATION.

12  BY MS. ARONSON:        

13          Q     DO YOU KNOW WHETHER OR NOT YOUR WIFE HAS 

14  HAD ANY PREVIOUS MARRIAGES?  

15          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO ANSWER THAT 

16  QUESTION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

17  SELF-INCRIMINATION.

18          Q     DO YOU KNOW WHETHER OR NOT YOUR WIFE OWNS 

19  ANY BANK ACCOUNTS?

20          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO ANSWER THAT 

21  QUESTION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

22  SELF-INCRIMINATION. 

23          Q     DO YOU KNOW WHETHER OR NOT YOUR WIFE OWNS 

24  ANY VEHICLES?

25          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO ANSWER THAT 

26  QUESTION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

27  SELF-INCRIMINATION.

28          Q     DO YOU KNOW WHETHER OR NOT YOUR WIFE OWNS 


                                                               17
			
			


 1  ANY OTHER ASSETS OVER $500?

 2          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO ANSWER THAT 

 3  QUESTION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

 4  SELF-INCRIMINATION.

 5          Q     IS YOUR WIFE PRESENTLY EMPLOYED?

 6          A     I RESPECTFULLY DECLINE TO ANSWER THAT 

 7  QUESTION ASSERTING MY FIFTH AMENDMENT RIGHT AGAINST 

 8  SELF-INCRIMINATION.

 9          Q     WHILE WE'RE ALSO ON RECORD, I WILL SUBMIT 

10  TO YOU AND SERVE YOU WITH A NOTICE OF ASSOCIATION OF 

11  COUNSEL.

12                MR. URTNOWSKI:  WE ALREADY RECEIVED IT THIS 

13  MORNING.

14  BY MS. ARONSON:  

15          Q     WHILE WE'RE AT IT, I WILL SERVE YOU WITH A 

16  NOTICE OF LIEN ON THE LAWSUIT WILLIS CARTO VERSUS LARRY 

17  ROOKER, R-O-O-K-E-R.

18                MR. URTNOWSKI:  WE RECEIVED THIS THIS 

19  MORNING.

20                MS. ARONSON:  OKAY.  GIVE ME TWO SECONDS.  

21  I THINK WE'RE ALL FINISHED HERE.  I DON'T HAVE AN EXTRA 

22  COPY.  I WOULD LIKE TO MAKE THE COPY OF THE SUBPENA AS 

23  EXHIBIT 1.

24                MR. URTNOWSKI:  THAT IS FINE.  JUST ATTACH 

25  IT.

26                MS. ARONSON:  ATTACH THIS AS EXHIBIT 1 AS A 

27  SUBPENA FOR TODAY.  THAT WILL CONCLUDE TODAY’s 

28  PROCEEDINGS.


                                                               18
			
			


 1                (THE ABOVE-DESCRIBED DOCUMENT WAS MARKED    

 2                EXHIBIT 1, RESPECTIVELY, FOR IDENTIFICATION 

 3                BY THE REPORTER.)       

 4                MR. URTNOWSKI:  THANK YOU. 

 5                CAN I GET A COPY OF THAT?  

 6                MR. SAMPSON:  MY NAME IS BRIAN SAMPSON.  

 7                LET’s ENTER INTO A STIPULATION WITH 

 8  MR. URTNOWSKI THAT THE COURT REPORTER WILL PREPARE THE 

 9  TRANSCRIPT, SEND A COPY TO OUR OFFICE, THE ORIGINAL TO 

10  MR. URTNOWSKI’s OFFICE.  MR. URTNOWSKI WILL THEN MEET 

11  WITH HIS CLIENT AND REVIEW AND MAKE ANY REVISIONS TO 

12  THAT.  GIVEN THE FACT THAT WE HAVE A HEARING ON APRIL THE 

13  10TH, HOW LONG WILL YOU NEED TO REVIEW AND RETURN THAT TO 

14  US?

15                MR. URTNOWSKI:  OFF THE RECORD. 

16                (DISCUSSION OFF THE RECORD.)              

17                MR. SAMPSON:  BACK ON THE RECORD.  

18                MR. URTNOWSKI INDICATED THAT IF HE HAS THE 

19  DEPOSITION WITHIN A WEEK, THEN HE WOULD NEED AN 

20  ADDITIONAL TWO WEEKS.  THAT PUTS IT TO MARCH 20TH AT THE 

21  LATEST.

22                MR. URTNOWSKI:  REAL SIMPLE, WHENEVER WE 

23  GET IT, WE WILL GET IT OUT IN TWO WEEKS BUT NO LATER THAN 

24  MARCH 20TH.

25                MR. SAMPSON:  I NEED A DROP-DEAD DATE.  I 

26  NEED A TIME PERIOD TO RESPOND TO YOUR MOTION.

27                MR. URTNOWSKI:  OFF THE RECORD.  

28                (DISCUSSION OFF THE RECORD.)  


                                                               19
			
			


 1                MR. SAMPSON:  BACK ON THE RECORD. 

 2                WE'VE AGREED THAT AS LONG AS THE COURT 

 3  REPORTER IS AMENABLE, WHICH SHE SAYS SHE IS, IT SHOULDN'T 

 4  BE A PROBLEM.  THAT IF YOU GET IT TO US WITHIN A WEEK, 

 5  THEN BY THE 20TH MR. CARTO WILL HAVE REVIEWED IT AND 

 6  RETURNED A COPY TO OUR OFFICE, TELEFAX OR MAIL, WHATEVER 

 7  IS EASIER FOR YOU IS FINE.  AND IF HE DOESN'T REVIEW AND 

 8  SIGN IT BY THE 20TH OF MARCH, THEN A CERTIFIED COPY FROM 

 9  THE COURT REPORTER MAY BE USED IN LIEU OF THE ORIGINAL.

10                MR. URTNOWSKI:  SO STIPULATED.  

11            (DEPOSITION CONCLUDED AT 11:05 A.M.)

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 5  I CERTIFY (OR DECLARE) UNDER PENALTY OF PERJURY UNDER THE

 6  LAWS OF THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA THAT THE FOREGOING IS

 7  TRUE AND CORRECT.

 8

 9              _________________________DATE

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12              _________________________SIGNATURE

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    STATE OF CALIFORNIA)
 2                     :
    COUNTY OF SAN DIEGO)
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 5         I, KOLLEEN FREYMUELLER, A CERTIFIED SHORTHAND 

 6  REPORTER, CERTIFICATE NO. 11230, DO HEREBY CERTIFY THAT 

 7  THE WITNESS IN THE FOREGOING DEPOSITION WAS BY ME FIRST 

 8  DULY SWORN TO TESTIFY TO THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH, AND 

 9  NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH IN THE FOREGOING CAUSE; THAT THE 

10  DEPOSITION WAS THEN TAKEN BEFORE ME AT THE TIME AND PLACE 

11  HEREIN NAMED; THAT SAID DEPOSITION WAS REPORTED BY ME IN 

12  SHORTHAND AND THEN TRANSCRIBED THROUGH COMPUTER-AIDED 

13  TRANSCRIPTION, AND THE FOREGOING TRANSCRIPT CONTAINS A 

14  TRUE RECORD OF THE DEPOSITION OF SAID WITNESS.

15         I DO FURTHER CERTIFY THAT I AM A DISINTERESTED 

16  PERSON AND AM IN NO WAY INTERESTED IN THE OUTCOME OF THIS 

17  ACTION OR CONNECTED WITH OR RELATED TO ANY OF THE PARTIES 

18  IN THIS ACTION OR TO THEIR RESPECTIVE COUNSEL.

19         IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I HAVE HEREUNTO SET MY HAND ON 

20  THIS______DAY OF________________,  1998, AT SAN DIEGO 

21  COUNTY, CALIFORNIA.

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23  ___________________________________________

24  KOLLEEN FREYMUELLER
    CERTIFICATE NO. 11230
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